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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2009, 08:29 PM
ksample817's Avatar
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Location: United States
Posts: 62
Angry Dual Language in Schools

I live in Texas. A certain city here started a Dual Language program in their schools. My school has told me that they are having some issues funding new text books for the elementary. NOT that the school needs NEW UP TO DATE books, but ENGLISH. I DO NOT live in a primarily Hispanic neighborhood, it's actually predominately black(I'm Asian, Husband's Black). My parents speak another language and really have nothing against speaking another language as long as it is not forced upon you. The new program apparently teaches 1 week all subjects in Spanish and 1 week in all English. I can understand learning a new language if you want to, but TELLING my children that they will have to learn in a language that they do not speak/write/understand is not, in my own opinion, appropriate for any matter. I do have Hispanic friends, so nothing against Hispanics, but don't force my children to learn Spanish just because schools don't want to have separate classes to teach NON English speaking students to speak English. My daughter's elementary also thoroughly made me angry because of the short handed English books(3 to 1) but have an over abundance of Spanish text books for an only Maybe 30% Spanish speaking population. If I want my children to speak another language, I will gladly teach them. I'm in the process of learning Japanese myself. Would like to hear some opinions!

KaSe
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2009, 08:54 PM
kamie3535's Avatar
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Location: United States
Posts: 7,222
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I'm sorry I saw the title, and just had to post a completely OT post I'd seen earlier.

Dear Mr. President:

I'm planning to move my family and extended family
into Mexico for my health, and I
would like to ask you to assist me.

We're planning to simply walk across the border from
the U.S. into Mexico, and we'll
need your help to make a few arrangements.

We plan to skip all the legal stuff like visas, passports,
immigration quotas and laws.

I'm sure they handle those things the same way you do
here. So, would you mind telling your buddy, President
Calderon, that I'm on my way over?

Please let him know that I will be expecting the
following:

1. Free medical care for my entire family.

2. English-speaking government bureaucrats for all
services I might need, whether I use them or not.

3. Please print all Mexican government forms in
English.

4. I want my grandkids to be taught Spanish by
English-speaking (bi-lingual) teachers.

5. Tell their schools they need to include classes on
American culture and history.

6. I want my grandkids to see the American flag on one
of the flag poles at their school.

7. Please plan to feed my grandkids at school for both
breakfast and lunch.

8. I will need a local Mexican driver's license so I
can get easy access to government services.

9. I do plan to get a car and drive
in Mexico, but, I don't plan to
purchase car insurance, and I probably won't make any
special effort to learn local traffic laws.

10. In case one of the Mexican police officers does not
get the memo from their president to leave me alone,
please be sure that every patrol car has at least one
English-speaking officer.

11. I plan to fly the U.S. flag from my house top,
put U S. flag decals on my car, and have a gigantic
celebration on July 4th. I do not want any complaints or
negative comments from the locals.

12. I would also like to have a nice job without paying
any taxes, or have any labor or tax laws enforced on any
business I may start.

13. Please have the president tell all the Mexican
people to be extremely nice and never say critical things
about me or my family, or about the strain we might place
on their economy.

14. I want to receive free food stamps.

15. Naturally, I'll expect free rent subsidies.

16. I'll need Income tax credits so although I
don't pay Mexican Taxes, I'll receive money from
the government.

17. Please arrange it so that the
Mexican Gov't pays $ 4,500 to help me buy a new
car.

18. Oh yes, I almost forgot, please enroll me free into
the Mexican Social Security program so that I'll get a
monthly income in retirement.

I know this is an easy request because you already do all
these things for all his people who walk over to
the U.S. from Mexico.
I am sure that
President Calderon won't mind returning the favor
if you ask him nicely.


Thank you so much for your kind help. You're the man!!!
__________________
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2009, 08:57 PM
rhondaklewis's Avatar
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Location: United States
Posts: 1,640
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This doesn't seem right or fair at all. If they were going to teach a language it should be the childs or parents choice of which language they wanted to learn. This certainly should have been discussed in a parents meeting so they could voice their opinions. Have you talked to other parents or the school officials?
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2009, 10:15 PM
lacandlegirl's Avatar
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Location: Missouri United States
Posts: 536
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KaSe _I am bilingual and it's a great advantage to speak two languages. It has opened many opportunities for me in life but with that being said I agree with you, I do not think it is right to make children learn it, I feel they should offer it if the parents would like for their childrne to learn a second language but not to be forced into it.

As for Kammie, you may not have written this but you posted it and I really dislike when ppl post things they really know little about. I'm not going to go round and round on the forms with you just saying my peace and leaving it at that.
__________________________________________________ ___________________________

I'm sure they handle those things the same way you do
here. So, would you mind telling your buddy, President
Calderon, that I'm on my way over?

Please let him know that I will be expecting the
following:

1. Free medical care for my entire family. <<<<<This is offered in several big cities. >>>>

2. English-speaking government bureaucrats for all
services I might need, whether I use them or not.

3. Please print all Mexican government forms in
English.

4. I want my grandkids to be taught Spanish by
English-speaking (bi-lingual) teachers. <<<<My Spanish teacher in the US was bi-lingual and I had no problems with her. >>>>>

5. Tell their schools they need to include classes on
American culture and history. <<< I grew up in the US and was NEVER taught Mexican culture or history don't know where you came up with that.>>>>>>>

6. I want my grandkids to see the American flag on one
of the flag poles at their school. <<<<<< I have NEVER seen the Mexican flag in any of our schools here. Show me a picture of one... ON A FLAG POLE.

7. Please plan to feed my grandkids at school for both
breakfast and lunch.

8. I will need a local Mexican driver's license so I
can get easy access to government services. <<<Just like in the US you will have to go through your government state office for this, they are not handed out for free here nor there>>>

9. I do plan to get a car and drive
in Mexico, but, I don't plan to
purchase car insurance, and I probably won't make any
special effort to learn local traffic laws. <<<<<< HAHAHA.....shows you have never be to Mexico or driven in this country. Insurance? hahahah....traffic laws?.....HAHAHAHA.>>>>>

10. In case one of the Mexican police officers does not
get the memo from their president to leave me alone,
please be sure that every patrol car has at least one
English-speaking officer. <<<I'm not a bad driver but the few times I have been pulled over there was NEVER a Spanish-speaking officer nearby. Nor have I been left alone because of my color.>>>>

11. I plan to fly the U.S. flag from my house top,
put U S. flag decals on my car, and have a gigantic
celebration on July 4th. I do not want any complaints or
negative comments from the locals. <<<<<<<<Complain you say? Who us? Heck, we love to celebrate, we make up holidays just to celebrate. We would join right in. hahaha. >>>>>

12. I would also like to have a nice job without paying
any taxes, or have any labor or tax laws enforced on any
business I may start.

<<<<<<<<<oh the famous "Mexicans don't pay taxes" lines.
1) Any time they work they pay taxes, it's taken out of there paycheck.
2) Any time they go shopping they pay taxes, or do you happen to know of a store that does not charge Mexicans taxes. Let me know if you do.
3) Just FYI, what many do not do is FILE taxes, meaning if they are owed money they don't claim it (where does that money go? You got it Uncle Sam.) Now if they owe, they owe and what does Uncle Sam do whey you owe money? He comes after you...nough said. >>>>>>>>>

13. Please have the president tell all the Mexican
people to be extremely nice and never say critical things
about me or my family, or about the strain we might place
on their economy. <<<<<<<I don't need any president to teach me or tell me how to treat other human beings. AND I WOULD BE GLAD TO SHOW YOU THE SAME COURTESY YOU ARE EXTENDING NOW.>>>>>>>

14. I want to receive free food stamps.

15. Naturally, I'll expect free rent subsidies. <<<<<Would a nice cardboard multi-use room due for you?>>>

16. I'll need Income tax credits so although I
don't pay Mexican Taxes, I'll receive money from
the government. <<<<<<<<<<<<THIS I DON'T GET. Didn't you just say we don't pay taxes. Now your saying we need income tax credits. Why would we need them if we don't pay taxes?????>>>>

17. Please arrange it so that the
Mexican Gov't pays $ 4,500 to help me buy a new
car. <<<<<<<<I have never been on Food Stamps in my whole life, I was not given 4,500 for a new car, I have never had the government pay for any of my rent or bills. >>>>

18. Oh yes, I almost forgot, please enroll me free into
the Mexican Social Security program so that I'll get a
monthly income in retirement.

I know this is an easy request because you already do all
these things for all his people who walk over to
the U.S. from Mexico.
I am sure that President Calderon won't mind returning the favor
if you ask him nicely.
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2009, 10:35 PM
tenXmom's Avatar
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Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 7,324
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I live it from this side and know about it - who is to say what Kamie knows? But I know Kamie well enough to know it's the illegals (from any country) she has the problem with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lacandlegirl View Post

As for Kammie, you may not have written this but you posted it and I really dislike when ppl post things they really know little about. I'm not going to go round and round on the forms with you just saying my peace and leaving it at that.


__________________________________________________ ___________________________

I'm sure they handle those things the same way you do
here. So, would you mind telling your buddy, President
Calderon, that I'm on my way over?

Please let him know that I will be expecting the
following:

1. Free medical care for my entire family. <<<<<This is offered in several big cities. >>>>
Here or in Mexico?

2. English-speaking government bureaucrats for all
services I might need, whether I use them or not.

3. Please print all Mexican government forms in
English.
You know I still haven't gotten over this one - CA voted on this in 1987 and still we pay millions of dollars every year to print in several languages

4. I want my grandkids to be taught Spanish by
English-speaking (bi-lingual) teachers. <<<<My Spanish teacher in the US was bi-lingual and I had no problems with her. >>>>>
Doesn't mean the tax payers want/need to pay extra so that every class has bi-lingual teachers

5. Tell their schools they need to include classes on
American culture and history. <<< I grew up in the US and was NEVER taught Mexican culture or history don't know where you came up with that.>>>>>>>
That's one complaint we've heard, not enough is taught


6. I want my grandkids to see the American flag on one
of the flag poles at their school. <<<<<< I have NEVER seen the Mexican flag in any of our schools here. Show me a picture of one... ON A FLAG POLE.
It wasn't an official act but yes - actually, it's old news
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y721T9nX0k
ALIPAC - Release: Pro illegal immigration protesters replace American flag with Mexican..
snopes.com: Mexican Flag at Montebello High School




7. Please plan to feed my grandkids at school for both
breakfast and lunch.

8. I will need a local Mexican driver's license so I
can get easy access to government services. <<<Just like in the US you will have to go through your government state office for this, they are not handed out for free here nor there>>>

9. I do plan to get a car and drive
in Mexico, but, I don't plan to
purchase car insurance, and I probably won't make any
special effort to learn local traffic laws. <<<<<< HAHAHA.....shows you have never be to Mexico or driven in this country. Insurance? hahahah....traffic laws?.....HAHAHAHA.>>>>>
HAHAHA traffic laws? We have them, learn them, use them


10. In case one of the Mexican police officers does not
get the memo from their president to leave me alone,
please be sure that every patrol car has at least one
English-speaking officer. <<<I'm not a bad driver but the few times I have been pulled over there was NEVER a Spanish-speaking officer nearby. Nor have I been left alone because of my color.>>>>

11. I plan to fly the U.S. flag from my house top,
put U S. flag decals on my car, and have a gigantic
celebration on July 4th. I do not want any complaints or
negative comments from the locals. <<<<<<<<Complain you say? Who us? Heck, we love to celebrate, we make up holidays just to celebrate. We would join right in. hahaha. >>>>>

12. I would also like to have a nice job without paying
any taxes, or have any labor or tax laws enforced on any
business I may start.

<<<<<<<<<oh the famous "Mexicans don't pay taxes" lines.
1) Any time they work they pay taxes, it's taken out of there paycheck.
Not when they're working under the table (again the problem is illegal aliens)

2) Any time they go shopping they pay taxes, or do you happen to know of a store that does not charge Mexicans taxes. Let me know if you do.
And because illegal aliens earn less they spend less, pay less sales tax - not all states have sales tax

3) Just FYI, what many do not do is FILE taxes, meaning if they are owed money they don't claim it (where does that money go? You got it Uncle Sam.) Now if they owe, they owe and what does Uncle Sam do whey you owe money? He comes after you...nough said. >>>>>>>>>
Or sometimes the person who owns the social security number they're using gets nailed for that extra unclaimed income

13. Please have the president tell all the Mexican
people to be extremely nice and never say critical things
about me or my family, or about the strain we might place
on their economy. <<<<<<<I don't need any president to teach me or tell me how to treat other human beings. AND I WOULD BE GLAD TO SHOW YOU THE SAME COURTESY YOU ARE EXTENDING NOW.>>>>>>>

14. I want to receive free food stamps.

15. Naturally, I'll expect free rent subsidies. <<<<<Would a nice cardboard multi-use room due for you?>>>

16. I'll need Income tax credits so although I
don't pay Mexican Taxes, I'll receive money from
the government. <<<<<<<<<<<<THIS I DON'T GET. Didn't you just say we don't pay taxes. Now your saying we need income tax credits. Why would we need them if we don't pay taxes?????>>>>
You can receive a tax return without paying one penny in taxes here - America is a wonderful country

17. Please arrange it so that the
Mexican Gov't pays $ 4,500 to help me buy a new
car. <<<<<<<<I have never been on Food Stamps in my whole life, I was not given 4,500 for a new car, I have never had the government pay for any of my rent or bills. >>>>

18. Oh yes, I almost forgot, please enroll me free into
the Mexican Social Security program so that I'll get a
monthly income in retirement.

I know this is an easy request because you already do all
these things for all his people who walk over to
the U.S. from Mexico.
I am sure that President Calderon won't mind returning the favor
if you ask him nicely.

Last edited by tenXmom; 09-12-2009 at 10:45 PM.
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2009, 11:21 PM
HighEnergyMom's Avatar
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That is a crazy system and education is going to suffer. These children will be behind. What are they going to do, hold tons of children back from second grade who didn't learn what they needed in first? Are they going to teach the same material the next week just in a different language?

I am certainly not against teaching children another language, but it should be a separate class and something that was chosen. If they can't afford the textbooks now, how are they going to afford it when the kids are not making the grade and have to be held back?

I think your school admin has gone multi-culti nutty and definitely not paying enough attention to actually educating the children properly. As their costs soar, you can bet so will your property taxes to help pay for their mistakes. If you can get the parents together and other interested parties in the neighborhood to discuss what actions you can take, it might be helpful. Unfortunately many people like to complain, and nobody wants to rock any boats. If enough parents are upset enough to mobilize, you could force some proper changes so that all the children will benefit.
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Old 09-13-2009, 06:08 AM
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Just as an FYI I live in a SMALL City in MA and we now are hiring officers that speak Spanish and Portuguese because we are a trilingual city. The Spanish speaking officers are no longer a hiring priority and if want to be considered have to compete with their Brazilian conterparts by learning a third language. Just an FYI not all of them feel it is "fair" that they have to learn another language to be considered for bilingual jobs. Unfortunatly for them, the larger second language population is no longer Spanish speaking, but Portguese. Just when do we realize this is getting out of hand? When do people stop feigning outrage and realize that not being able to communicate is not a matter of cultural pride, but economic and potentially physical disaster for all parties involved? The time has come to challenge people to learn English not accomadate the unwillingness to learn. Make ESL more widely available, but expect people to use English. Get Church and secular groups on board to make this a priority. The more people are divided by language barriers, the deeper the divides.

We are constantly complaining about the fact we lack basic funds for traditional educational subjects. We cannot afford the ever expanding number of languages people wish to be accomadated for in this country. It is time to make people learn if they wish to participate in this country. In the same way it is time for Americans to learn foreign languages to be eligible to participate in a Global economy. We can't be the ugly Americans stumbling through the world expecting others to accomadate our lack of language skills. However, we don't do anyone any favors by wasting valuable education and government dollars printing materials in languages to help people avoid learning English.

Last edited by Bailey4; 09-13-2009 at 06:14 AM.
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Old 09-13-2009, 06:19 AM
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I would respond but Laura said most of what I have to say. There is one more thing I could add. I grew up on the Mississippi gulf coast where there are a lot of illegal Vietnamese. 25 years ago they began coming in. Originally they only upset the applecart for shrimp boat workers who were making about $15-20 an hour hauling shrimp (big money back then). They came in and went to work for half, cash under the table, and no benefits. No one really complained because it was just the shrimp boat workers (I used to defend them too as it was really the job few people WANTED).

But today, 25 years later, their kids are legal because they were born in the US. Those kids did get free educations. Because their parents have no record of income, they got free college educations. NOW, those 'anchor babies' have had everything handed to them (and yes their parents were able to get WIC, foodstamps, and many other government benefits --not to mention charitable benefits) when their parents were making more money than the average household on the coast at the time (this was long before the casinos came in and boosted the coastal economy).

I used to think that those opposed to illegal aliens (yes, let's NOT forget that they are here in flagrant disregard to our laws) were being a little alarmist but when you stop to think about it, there are over 12 million people living in this country illegally. Can you imagine what a difference it would make to our CITIZENS who are currently jobless if everyone of those jobs held by ILLEGAL workers in this country was suddenly open?

Can you imagine how it would impact the cost of our health care, education, and even our police force budgets not to have to cover 12 million additional and undocumented people each and every year? Even if it cut one dollar per person from the overall cost in health care, education, and public safety that would be 36 million dollars a year. You want health care reform? Try that on for size.
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Old 09-13-2009, 06:27 AM
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Just look at how the health care number fluctuate depending on how we include illegal (not legal) immigrants in the debate. No matter what anyone argues when someone shows up at the hospital looking for emergency care it is provided at our cost for illegal immigrants. It has been one of the issues in MA which has moved to the health care system the Democrats want. We robbed our free care pool to subsidize our health insurance premiums for the uninsured by "pretending" that we don't have illegal immigrants in this state using the free care pool to provide for their health care needs. Lo and behold when the hospitals started being honest about the realities of providing for illegal immigrant medical care, words like racist started to be thrown out. It wasn't racist just practical conversations. If you are going to remove the free care pool to pay for the uninsured premiums and you are not going to require illegal immigrants to get insurance, who will pay the hospital emergency room bills?

Well we continue to fight that issue in this state. The state promises money to the hospitals, the hospitals have raised costs to paying customers. It is not a subject state reps or the Governor want to address. After all how does one discuss paying for illegal immigrant health care without being charged with racism?
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Old 09-13-2009, 06:40 AM
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Like it or not Latinos are the fastest growing demographic in the US and soon to be new majority (and no not all are illegal) so you might as well get a head start on learning the language now I'm in Texas too but the students have the option to learn Spanish in Elementary school in certain districts. I think it's great planning ahead on the district's part since when these children are of working age most of the relevant jobs will require you to be bilingual. I guess this is how the Native Americans felt when the whites began taking over their country, outgrowing their population and replacing their language. ROFL!!!
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